tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post759517771260975665..comments2024-03-14T15:18:36.168+08:00Comments on Hong Kong Referee: Referees In Tune With Team Tacticshkrefhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14758566148041958225noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-12812314586581561012011-05-04T00:30:49.882+08:002011-05-04T00:30:49.882+08:00To all those saying Pepe's leg was at an '...To all those saying Pepe's leg was at an 'unnatural angle' and that he 'meant to hurt Alves', I don't know where you're getting this from.<br /><br />What's unnatural about it? It's how you reach for things, stretching a limb out to its full extent. I'm not saying it wasn't dangerous, it was, and it probably deserved at least a yellow, but there's no proof it was deliberate. He did actually touch the ball first, so you can't exactly argue he wasn't going for it.Jude Elleryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01468148324501984439noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-28475621047877715782011-05-03T00:56:17.618+08:002011-05-03T00:56:17.618+08:00HKRef,
Great site. As a fellow ref, it is great t...HKRef,<br /><br />Great site. As a fellow ref, it is great to see a bit of informed debate on the subject. Too often the discourse devolves into partisan yelling, and opportunistic pontification by the Andy Townsends of the world. <br /><br />While I agree with your analysis of the individual decisions Stark made, I differ in my view of his overall performance. <br /><br />First of all, it must be said that it was an extremely difficult game to officiate. Both teams were looking for any excuse to vent three games' worth of pent-up frustration and outrage. This was outside of his control, but he did not do enough to reign it in. <br /><br />As a referee, one of your core responsibilities is to create an atmosphere of fair play. The way you do that is to earn the respect and trust of players. Players who trust that the referee will punish attempts to break the rules tend to stick to playing football. Referees who lose that trust (often referred to as: control of the game), see players lose control of their emotions and the game devolves into a spectacle where football is notable in its absence. <br /><br />Stark did not establish control of the game early enough and was overly lenient with early fouls and dives. Predictably, they escalated. This has been a consistent weakness in Stark's performances for years. In my opinion he relies on his stern appearance and refusal to be drawn into discussions of his decisions to avoid dealing with dissent. His common retreat from protesting players sends a message of weakness that players react to by pushing the boundaries of the law, in a correct assumption that he can be manipulated. He allows ill feelings to foster on both sides, and this shows in the evolution of the games he calls. <br /><br />This is not to demean the rest of his performance. He is a top class referee who excells in nearly all areas, but he is human, and this is one area where I believe he suffers. <br /><br />For all of the permissiveness of Undiano Mallenco, his superior game control allowed an equally heated Copa del Rey Final between these two teams to develop into an entertaining football match. There was no shortage of foul play or gamesmanship in that game either, but he kept the players more focused on playing than his German counterpart.<br /><br />I hope De Bleeckere has a better performance than Stark's. Nobody wants another spectacle like last week's.Gael Gazpachohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12343560368216650712noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-27128833680102172282011-05-02T19:20:10.575+08:002011-05-02T19:20:10.575+08:00Thanks everyone for reading this post, and for the...Thanks everyone for reading this post, and for the interesting comments.<br /><br />I'll start from where I finished by repeating this sentence: <i>"Mourinho is his own worst enemy."</i> To be clear, I support and advocate football matches to be fair, safe and enjoyable. Gamesmanship goes against these principles because it is a negative facet of football. Although Mourinho did not introduce gamesmanship to football (it has always been present, since the very beginning of competitive matches), his track record shows that he is a chief proponent of the "dark arts" and will not hesitate to tell his players to act in a certain way, if it will help gain any advantage for his team. For instance, this season alone we have seen how he has used his substitutes and assistant coaches to <b>a)</b> pass on messages verbally to his on-field players to intentionally gain yellow cards and send-offs (e.g. Alonso, Ramos in the Champions League final group match); <b>b)</b> influence ARs, 4th Officials and the Referee by immediately disputing and antagonizing them; and <b>c)</b> pass pieces of paper with written instructions to his on-field players. <br /><br />All this gamesmanship leads to ill-feeling and, sooner rather than later, other teams will decide to either reciprocate or retaliate. For example, we have seen retaliation in the form of playacting; which is a direct response to Mourinho's tough style of play linked with <b>Coordinated and Sustained Referee Baiting</b>. As a result, fans start complaining about all the tricks, theatrics and histrionics and also mistakenly vent their criticisms at match officials. All the match officials can do is to be aware of team tactics and apply the Laws consistently. They also need help and support from the FAs (UEFA, FIFA, FA, etc) that will protect them from all the unsporting behaviour and mind games which have come about mainly from the team tactics so favoured by Mourinho. For example, UEFA should take action against the substitutes seen disputing and influencing ARs (as highlighted in Incident Two). And as I said before, if other teams cannot beat such gamesmanship, they will join in and ultimately football (and football fans) will be the big losers. Is this what we want to see in football?<br /><br />Mourinho is his own worst enemy.hkrefhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14758566148041958225noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-56866191766630943002011-05-01T14:39:31.613+08:002011-05-01T14:39:31.613+08:00I believe Pepe did intend to hurt Alves, or at lea...I believe Pepe did intend to hurt Alves, or at least give him physical un-ease with a challenge straight at his ankle/shin area.<br /><br />as pointed out by you, his leg was locked in position and he braced for impact, which is necessary when attempting to collide with something much bigger than the football.<br /><br />Claims about Pepe not touching Alves I believe are false.<br /><br />firstly, I heard contact. I heard on live television the impact and Alves's shout immediately afterwards.<br /><br />Also, video editors and special effect designers have pointed out inconsistencies to the frames of the videos Madrid based press have released. They shortened Pepe's leg with editing to justify Pepe's innocence.<br /><br />At first I believed it, but after seeing a replay of the match, I realized that there was no way in which Alves could've thrown himself to the ground with one leg, in no position to balance himself or draw energy from the ground. His waist was turning the opposite direction. something else had to make him fall in that direction, and that something had to be Pepe's challenge.<br /><br />I believe that it was a mild touch,Pepe didn't sink his boot in Alves's leg.<br />And Dani Alves could have been acting when he rolled around on the floor for a couple of seconds.<br /><br />but the intention was clearly there and that's what Stark dismissed pepe for. his intention for the challenge and the fact that he made contact with Dani Alves gave him the go to give Pepe the red.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-64310808361510254362011-05-01T09:10:19.786+08:002011-05-01T09:10:19.786+08:001) "going for the ball" or "got the...1) "going for the ball" or "got the ball first" does not automatically void a foul!! <br />2) I agree w/ James...the unnatural angle of his foot is deliberate=serious foul play.<br />3) I hated the dramatics by BOTH sides, many comments seem to accuse Barca but by silence absolve RM of simulation etc.Teflon Dadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08628733595253633230noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-39991789310627174512011-05-01T00:01:22.320+08:002011-05-01T00:01:22.320+08:00Spot on - well, there are only two things I disagr...Spot on - well, there are only two things I disagree with:<br /><br />1 - I think Pepe's challenge was more rash than cynical, he was going for the ball, and<br /><br />2 - Andy Townsend is not a nice guy, he's a prick.<br /><br />By the way, have you seen this? Which do you think is the real one?<br /><br />http://bit.ly/k19bY3 or http://bit.ly/kmR6Lz.Jude Elleryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01468148324501984439noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-2577880612998097722011-04-30T19:43:20.816+08:002011-04-30T19:43:20.816+08:00Anonymous cough cough, that's a well-known mai...Anonymous cough cough, that's a well-known maipulated video.<br /><br />Mr. Refree, you forgot to mention that Stark should have shown a red card to Chendo after grabbing Pinto from the neck.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-83951338177698256872011-04-30T09:12:40.674+08:002011-04-30T09:12:40.674+08:00Selectively highlighting certain incidents isn'...Selectively highlighting certain incidents isn't a good scientific method to evaluate whether a referee did well or not. You didn't really mention the Mascherano tackle on Pepe just minutes before did you? It was rather similar. Please go through absolutely every single decision made by the referee (i.e. every stoppage of play) and comment on it, or else you lack credibility. (I leave aside other issues since this is the first one that needs to be addressed before your analysis can be taken seriously)Nihitnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-40693926348289624262011-04-29T19:05:52.686+08:002011-04-29T19:05:52.686+08:00Why do referees let these total knobs get away wit...Why do referees let these total knobs get away with this? Also, why do football refs lack balls, like their rugby counterparts have?<br />Surely Pedro, and Busquets should have at least been cautioned (I reckon sent off would have been better) for trying to con the ref into getting an opponent sent off.<br />For me this is now Barca´s plan B. If the pretty football doesn´t work because the other team always have 10 men behind the ball and are very well organised, they resort to trying to get opponents sent off to create the space.<br />I have lost virtually all respect for Barca and have not had any repsect for Fifa/Uefa for allowing these scumbags to get away with this.<br />They should be totally embarrassed.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-34777110349617274262011-04-29T18:47:50.459+08:002011-04-29T18:47:50.459+08:00Funny how English commentators tried to justify th...Funny how English commentators tried to justify the red card, influencing their watchers.<br /><br />While on the Spanish/Dutch/German tv they all called it a correct RED cardAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-38071059893256990272011-04-29T18:46:51.461+08:002011-04-29T18:46:51.461+08:00Nana said: Marca, the pro-Madrid based news paper ...Nana said: Marca, the pro-Madrid based news paper asked their readers if Pepe's red card was correct using a poll.<br /><br />"In an online poll more than 72% of Marca's readers disagreed with Mourinho's comments that referees favoured Barcelona. (Some 78% felt Pepe's red card was correct.)"<br /><br />http://business.webpagesonlineng.com/champions-league-press-reaction-mourinho-has-perverted-history/<br /><br />It has a daily readership of over 2,749,000, the highest in Spain for a daily newspaper, and more than half of sports readership.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-60530403707769975912011-04-29T18:19:21.333+08:002011-04-29T18:19:21.333+08:00Really interesting and well informed piece. Lookin...Really interesting and well informed piece. Looking forward to following your blog in the future.<br /><br />As for the Pepe tackle - look at his follow through after making initial contact with the ball. Instead of following its natural path, Pepe alters the direction of the follow through very slightly in order to follow Alves' leg and therefore make his mark on the player. Correct decision by Stark in my eyes.Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-7290773417562158552011-04-29T18:15:09.341+08:002011-04-29T18:15:09.341+08:00The 'Mourinho's expression tells us that h...The 'Mourinho's expression tells us that he knows what's going on' type of comments add an element of bias in your article that makes more difficult to take it seriously.Fair Playhttp://www.google.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-27292451447720906022011-04-29T18:11:31.606+08:002011-04-29T18:11:31.606+08:00Studs up by Pepe, both players challeging to get t...Studs up by Pepe, both players challeging to get the ball that wasn't under any of both players control. It's a yellow card at best.Fair Playhttp://www.google.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-70842682739040149362011-04-29T11:11:38.613+08:002011-04-29T11:11:38.613+08:00also you should look at this video
http://www.you...also you should look at this video<br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MsyWYQR2iI0&feature=player_embedded<br /><br />which gives a somewhat different view of the incidentNeverEverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16822581407125914036noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-36000883555267912502011-04-29T11:08:51.355+08:002011-04-29T11:08:51.355+08:00to Anonymous
*caugh*caugh
the card was not for c...to Anonymous<br /><br />*caugh*caugh<br /><br />the card was not for contact but for a studs up and dangerous challenge<br /><br />seeing it in slow motion I would have given alves a yellow for simulation but the action occurred so fast that it would have been impossible to determine with the naked eye on the pitch.<br /><br />This is one of the drawbacks of no replays for the refs and is an aspect of football that you have to accept as a fan.NeverEverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16822581407125914036noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-65462789280349340612011-04-29T09:03:53.370+08:002011-04-29T09:03:53.370+08:00Very informative, especially seeing through the ob...Very informative, especially seeing through the objective POV of an experienced referee such as yourself, rather than through a fan of either team. Thank you.ObjectivelySpeakinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00811984969569894304noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-53114841950546182172011-04-29T07:38:17.839+08:002011-04-29T07:38:17.839+08:00*cough *cough
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2oR...*cough *cough<br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2oRXFRl6QEAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-46635001029248046012011-04-29T04:10:58.097+08:002011-04-29T04:10:58.097+08:00And Mr. Anonymous, I'm not sure what you'r...And Mr. Anonymous, I'm not sure what you're trying to prove, seeing as this post has plenty of freeze frames detailing the incident.<br /><br />In any case, this was a nice read. As a Barca fan, you probably could have gone more into the specific times that Barcelona players playacted though.Ryannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4715494982371884149.post-81173830272120627982011-04-29T03:54:13.637+08:002011-04-29T03:54:13.637+08:00if you saw the match live and the replays.. you wo...if you saw the match live and the replays.. you would know that Pepe's send off was incorrect.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com